July 2, 2008
Is Genepax Water Car a Hoax?
After seeing that Reuter's video on Genepax's water car, and doing all the background research, and writing story which ended up in wikipedia as well… I have few thoughts I wish to share with you my reader…
Before posting my story on Genepax water car I did a few days of research on finding anything related, and was overwhelmed with number of existing solutions that use water to run some sort of engine or car. Yes - water is always used as a fuel - to be (by different kind of procedures) transformed into hydrogen, which then is the final source of energy…
But the idea of getting car run on water seem to be older than gas cars - even Tesla at end of 1890's way toying with the idea, and some source claim, he even managed to get it working… (caution: possible conspiracy fairytale), but then every 20 years some "inventor" was publicly showing off something related to producing free energy from water… One of those was also Stanley Meyer, who died in shady circumstances, and whose water car prototype was stolen shortly after… Also a number of patents were filled as one might find in patents database…
What also amazed me, was THOUSANDS of videos on youtube, showing people working on free energy cars - running on water, hydrogen and even something called orgone energy (whatever that may be)… Just google for "joe cell" or "hydrogen cell"… or "orgone energy"… All these videos - made by thousands of different people - in last 20 years time frame - can they all be one large hoax?
Maybe, but personally I believe there is something to it (I do recognize a bunch of fake videos, intended as ads for various e-books selling water car conversion manual… Careful with those..)…
In last week I also build my own "Joe Cell", and I can confirm, that with $14 worth of materials, and a car battery charger, I was able to produce hydrogen gas. Can this be used to run a car? Probably not out of the box, and probably not efficient (when looking on whole energy-footprint), but with something advanced - why not. As one of my readers commented, and with what I couldn't agree more:
The First Law of Thermodynamics was derived in the mid 1800's. To think that this knowledge applies to everything in the universe when in the 1800's people never heard of atomic explosions which by the way release much larger quantities of energy then is used up to cause the explosion is ludicrous. Not everything in the universe can possibly be explained by this law because we don't know everything about the universe……. Believing that something wont work because of something thought up over 100 years ago is blind on your part. Where would we be today if we though like people 100 years ago. Heck DNA was thought to be unimportant until the mid 1900's. I just say why not? Prove them wrong yourself or prove them right.
I do not hold degree in chemistry or physics, but as I started my careere as a computer magazine journalist I got my share of insider information from industry giants like … Toshiba, where they have developed and tested and ready to mass-produce battery-recharging technology, that would recharge laptop battery from empty to full in 3 minutes… Why don't they release it? Because Toshiba is part of larger multi-billion-corporation, which has strong ties also with Oil related corporations - and that was seen as a bad business move… Don't believe me? See video on that site, or google it- many sources confirm it. It is also cheap technology - that would raise the price of battery by only 10-15%… Also, I am sure you heard stories about Ni-MH batteries - where a company which invented the most promising battery technology (GM Ovonics) lately was bought by Texaco/Chevron oil company, and consequently all right to use this kind of battery in electric cars was limited to NO PLUGINS. Heck, you saw a movie "Who killed electric car"…
What I want to say is - keep your mind open.
Sooner or later, the next step in technology evolution will happen, no matter how much resources and money holders of today's largest money incomes are pouring into delaying this day…
BTW… I also contacted Genepax for more information, and will report here in detail as soon as something new happens! But from my dealings with Japanese people and companies - who still very much believe in honour - I do not think Genepax is a hoax. But lets wait and see…
Comments on Is Genepax Water Car a Hoax? »
I agree, no matter how many corporations try to stop us from getting off their CRUD… We WILL, and much sooner than they think! For some more examples of alternative vehicles check out: http://www.HiddenBuzz.com
The idea that a rock rolls from the top of the hill, down to the bottom of the hill, is tens of thousands of years old. And the only way to get that rock to the top of the hill is to use some energy to get it back up the hill.
Water is at the bottom of the chemical hill.
Hydrogen and Oxygen are at the top.
Things at the top of the hill always want to go to the bottom. Thats why hydrogen burns and makes water and gives off energy.
If you want to make Hydrogen again you need energy to push that rock to the top of the hill.
The first rule of thermodynamics will stand, in perpetuity, just as the law of gravity allows the rock to roll down that hill.
Water is at the bottom of the energy hill, thats why the earth has so much of it.
Its a scam
Paul W…
Glad to see you have such an open mind!
Ed…
Since you are obviously very "open-minded", I trust your enthusiasm about investing in this promising new technology. It assures you a 1000-fold return on your investment. Please send me all your money, without delay, so we can help this great technological and social advancement, while profiting therefrom as well.
Well let's see…what if you were to split the water molecule…THEN you'd have the hydrogen…right at the top of your NRG hill…
Well let's see, Chavis … what do you plan to split that water molecule with? Could that be … ENERGY? :-/ Think dude.
The first law of thermodynamis is logical. If you drop something, you have to pick it up again. If you run water through a turbine it takes solar energy to evaporate it so it rains down from above.
Bringing in nuclear power is exactly why the law is still valid. It has been updated and modified over time. The big change was mass-energy equivalence, and this is what powers a nuclear reactor. Energy can be converted to mass, and mass to energy, but neither can be created new.
What it basically comes down to is that burning hydrogen and oxygen into water is exothermic, that is it releases energy. Under ideal circumstances, this energy is exactly the same amount of energy that is required to split it back apart again. Driving a mechanical system off this (a car's wheels) removes some of this energy, leaving insufficient to perform the split. Therefore any system that "runs on water" has some other energy source.
In practice, it is even worse than this. A hydrogen to combustion to water to electrolysis to hydrogen cycle will not work even if you don't remove any mechanical energy. The second law of thermodynamics is also logical. When you run a generator or motor, it heats up. The heat has to come from somewhere, and it is not physically possible to capture all of this heat. The lost heat is energy lost to the system, and thus energy not available to convert water back to hydrogen. This is even more external energy that must be brought in from somewhere else.
I'm not saying don't buy a water car if you really want to, (I won't but you can), I'm just saying check really closely for wires or batteries before you invest.
I would like to see someone driving one of these hydrogen cars and show the internals of the engine. If it is a real technology then someone will build it.
THINK you say… you talk about theses so called LAWs as if they are in no way able to be amended or completly blowen out of the water! lol, no pun intended!
WAKE UP! try open that limited little brain to the possibility that all the LAWS you hold so dear will be re written 3 times over before we get most the picture.
Hoax my arse!
Yes, it IS a hoax. That is, it does not run on "just water".
Reuters reporters are not known for their accuracy or diligence (they are a rung below Fox News in that regard).
It takes more energy to break water apart so the hydrogen can be used, that you get from using the hydrogen. They are using a metal hydride reaction to split the water, and since the hydride is not a catalytic, it is consumed, it needs to be replaced.
Thus, this is NOT a "water only" car - it needs to be "refueled" with metal hydride AND water.
It is perhaps stated best by the company itself: "we have yet to overcome the many obstacles we face".
Yea, that first law of thermodynamics is a pesky one to overcome, now isn't it?
I agree that to take water apart, input it in a black box, output it to something that produce water again means you invest more energy than the process gives. BUT, is it possible that instead of H2+O you get H+H+O ? is it possible that the water at the output are produced by other materials or gases that exist around it ?
Paul, just relax and watch your children outstand you…
No matter how much pride you hold inside your heart, it will happen, there's really nothing you can do.
Regards,
*sigh* you can't argue with these wishful thinkers… the people claiming its a hoax have given plenty of sound scientific examples of why this doesn't work. The only thing the proponents have said was pretty much: your laws might be wrong…